Ace profile picture
Ace profile picture

Ace

CEO

Arsonist
Politicker
Valued Contributor
+7

Flat Organization VS Hierarchy

There have been many experiments regarding the organizational structures. Some have worked wonderfully while others haven't. What's your take?

Which one do you prefer?

Attached poll
*Voting in this poll no longer yields commission.
🐱 Off-Topic
6

36 comments

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1nbatopshotfan
Politicker
1
Sales
After our acquisition which was generally hierarchical we moved to a flat set up. I’m not a fan. It’s hard to know who to go to for certain things and where to go now that the org chart is a pancake. 
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
But in flat org, you are supposed to take ownership of everything. And approval and permissions are supposed to be suspended. It won't work otherwise
1nbatopshotfan
Politicker
2
Sales
That makes a ton of sense, but we have combined two very different mentalities and business processes which makes interacting with the other side of our business nearly impossible. 
Ace
Arsonist
2
CEO
Yes, that's what acquisitions do. The proper fit needs to be worked out. One can't blindly plug one org into another
1nbatopshotfan
Politicker
2
Sales
O it’s a been a totally blind plug in. Like connecting legos to magna tiles with duct tape. 
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
Are there any efforts being taken to work that out? Or people are just expected to continue as if nothing happened?
1nbatopshotfan
Politicker
2
Sales
It’s on the roadmap, but integration and cost cutting is first, for sure. I’m thankful that my business unit hasn’t changed at all, and neither has our department. 
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
That's good. At least it's on the cards
1nbatopshotfan
Politicker
3
Sales
I should have used quotes. It’s “on the roadmap” but that’s about all that’s been done. I’m not holding my breath. We’ve become the industry leader and largest player in our space during this acquisition and I honestly think we are missing a great deal of opportunity by how the integration has been handled. 

Like I said, I feel lucky that my division isn’t really affected and hasn’t changed, but will be cautious about how things move forward. 
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
Gotcha. Well that's good that you're not affected. You get to keep your sanity haha
1nbatopshotfan
Politicker
2
Sales
Totally. Nice chatting this am. Appreciate the back and forth! 
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
Likewise!
SalesPharaoh
Big Shot
1
Senior Account Executive
I think it depends on the company and product but a really really cool book to read about that is called Team of Teams by Stanely McChrystal amazing take on how to have a dynamic adapable org structure
Ace
Arsonist
0
CEO
Added to my to read list. Thanks a lot
Wolfof7thStreet
Valued Contributor
1
AE
Having a hierarchy is good, as long as the managers/VPs are good. It is great to have leaders from the company that you can pull into calls, clients love feeling special enough to have a VP on the 2nd call
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
That is true. 100%
Chep
WR Officer
0
Bitcoin Adoption Specialist
I think it's important to have a balance. Typically, you'll need a boss to make sure people are actually working, but making sure the workers feel like they have a voice is key I.M.O
Ace
Arsonist
0
CEO
Yeah that makes sense. A lot of orgs miss the 2 way communication
Zags
Good Citizen
0
Global Account Manager
I think if you need a boss to make sure people are working, there's already a problem there. Especially in sales. If you're not actively trying to sell, you won't last. 
Rallier
Politicker
0
SDR Manager and Consultant
Having worked in both, hierarchical is definitely better. With flat organizations, it takes too long to make decisions and too many people are involved. It sounds great, but in reality, it's frustrating.
Ace
Arsonist
0
CEO
Got it. How big was the flat company you worked at?
Indakitchenwhippin
Politicker
0
Channel Sales
Hierarchical, if the org is too flat I have found that advancement and "ladder climbing" is quite difficult and takes a lot longer, which  for myself and I imagine most sales people is very unappealing.
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
But there won't be any ladder climbing. You made it! Haha jk.

But I do get your point
c4miller
Opinionated
0
Sales Manager
I'd say with the right structure, hierarchy will always win here. multiple levels of leadership allow for upward mobility and better structure in internal decision making. It also helps keep tenure and experience in the org. 

The areas where this usually fails is when bad leaders get promoted and become intrenched in positions of authority and creates an environment that repels talent and prevents success for everyone involved. 
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
But politics can't be discounted. People just love to fuck it up 
c4miller
Opinionated
1
Sales Manager
Very true. There isn't an easy way to build the system when starting from scratch but the potential is always worth the risk in my opinion
Ace
Arsonist
0
CEO
Yeah that makes sense!
goose
Politicker
0
Sales Executive
Like most polls, the answer is "it depend"s.  How many sales people are in your organization?  There are ratios for sales people to managers, managers to directors, directors to VP's.

100 sales people?  Probably need 10 to 12 managers, 2 or 3 directors and a VP.

10 sales people?  Probably just need that VP.
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
True but thats from a sales perspective. I am looking at the organization across all departments and levels
goose
Politicker
0
Sales Executive
I believe the ratios still apply.  I don't understand what a flat organization looks like... everyone reporting to the CEO?
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
Not really. Everyone is the CEO. They make their own decisions, own POs and everything
goose
Politicker
0
Sales Executive
I haven't seen that.
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
If you've heard of Nucor, they're one of the organizations that do that
goose
Politicker
0
Sales Executive
Ok.  I see that.  But the first person I found on Linked In is the Director of Corporate Logistics.  Does that mean they are the only one in corporate logistics?  Seems odd.
Ace
Arsonist
1
CEO
No they're not. They're 2000+ employees but due to flat hierarchy not everyone has a set designation
CuriousFox
WR Officer
0
🦊
There's a middle ground. I'd choose that lol

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