I am curious if the PiP is just part of every sales guys career or if it's something no one ever gets off and its time to jump ship.
Zeb
Has anyone other sales savages survived the Performance Improvement Plan (PiP) ?
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Story time: My first sales job ever, I started in a class of 4 new hires. 3 months in, all 3 of them have hit quota at least once. Meanwhile, I have closed 0 deals. Like literally 0.
The MD of the office calls me in. Gives me the "hey we really like you...but you're not performing" talk. Questions whether I really want it or not. Is my heart in it? Do I care? Because I'm "too smart to suck like this."
I get sent home for the day. I've never failed at anything in my life like this. Sit in my car crying. Go home and stare at my ceiling for a few hours. Angry, frustrated, terrified, sad. My first ever "real" job..and I'm getting fired.
Can't sleep all night. I get up at 4am and drive to office. Start prospecting with a fire I didn't know I had. Next month, I hit 200% of quota. That year, I am the #1 salesperson out of 1000. Break the company's all time sales record.
PiPs are a fork in the road. Either you get the message or you don't. I got it. Hope you do too.
The MD of the office calls me in. Gives me the "hey we really like you...but you're not performing" talk. Questions whether I really want it or not. Is my heart in it? Do I care? Because I'm "too smart to suck like this."
I get sent home for the day. I've never failed at anything in my life like this. Sit in my car crying. Go home and stare at my ceiling for a few hours. Angry, frustrated, terrified, sad. My first ever "real" job..and I'm getting fired.
Can't sleep all night. I get up at 4am and drive to office. Start prospecting with a fire I didn't know I had. Next month, I hit 200% of quota. That year, I am the #1 salesperson out of 1000. Break the company's all time sales record.
PiPs are a fork in the road. Either you get the message or you don't. I got it. Hope you do too.
Thank you, Sahil. I appreciate your insight and candor on the matter. You are a salesperson I really respect and admire. To hear you've struggled in the past really gives me hope.
They call me Scotty PiPpen
But in all seriousness, no. I've never been put on one.
But in all seriousness, no. I've never been put on one.
Noice
Haha! Everyone claims "they've never been on one" but we all seem to know an awful lot about it.
I’ve put other sales reps on PiPs when i managed teams
How many in % contiuned to work for you?
If I remember correctly, I only had to put 2 people on a PiP and one succeeded and the other, not so much so 50%
ah ok, that's not a big number of people.
My former CRO explained to me that there are 2 types of PIPs...
1) We believe you have it in you and want to light a fire under you.
2) We are going to make your new goals outrageous because we want you out.
1) We believe you have it in you and want to light a fire under you.
2) We are going to make your new goals outrageous because we want you out.
Seems legit. Username checks out.
This is generally how it is at my company. I just put one of my reps through a PiP and it was the former - we want you to stay, but right now you are absolutely horrible abs need to improve if you want to stay. She ended up passing and is now a fantastic rep.
I've been on one and I've seen top performers get one too. Especially with a pandemic going around I saw a lot of it where I was.
Its stressful and in my experience I felt like I was doing it alone. Its hard because it leads to uncertainty and it leads to you feeling like a failure if it doesn't work out.
Two big take aways I've learned are
1. Sales is a profession just like a Doctor or like a Teacher. It takes time to get good at it and I think the majority of the people on this platform would say they have a lot they need to work on. The main difference between our jobs and some of these others is we have 2 weeks of training and are left to figure it out on our own. Its a learn by fire kind of job so its no wonder why people have times when they struggle.
2. Because you have been put on a PIP does not mean you are worse than or inferior to another sales rep. It does not mean that you can't do this job or you are unable to bounce back. Take it as a learning opportunity and get yourself to your next level. There are plenty of sales positions and you will take what you learn here and apply it somewhere else.
Its stressful and in my experience I felt like I was doing it alone. Its hard because it leads to uncertainty and it leads to you feeling like a failure if it doesn't work out.
Two big take aways I've learned are
1. Sales is a profession just like a Doctor or like a Teacher. It takes time to get good at it and I think the majority of the people on this platform would say they have a lot they need to work on. The main difference between our jobs and some of these others is we have 2 weeks of training and are left to figure it out on our own. Its a learn by fire kind of job so its no wonder why people have times when they struggle.
2. Because you have been put on a PIP does not mean you are worse than or inferior to another sales rep. It does not mean that you can't do this job or you are unable to bounce back. Take it as a learning opportunity and get yourself to your next level. There are plenty of sales positions and you will take what you learn here and apply it somewhere else.
Great reply. Thank you.
PiPs are fine (I've been on PiPs and have put people who worked for me on plan). Sometimes it's obvious the person on PiP needs to go. Sometimes it really is meant to turn things around (and sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't.)
What's worse is the double-secret-probation style of PiP. The kind of email from your boss that makes you ask (sometimes actually ask, not just think), "Did I just get put on plan?" And Bossman and HR won't tell you. Those are the days where you walk into a meeting at HQ, about to head into the conference room with a customer and are dragged by HR into another room and fired because they meant to do it over the phone later that day and didn't realize you were coming in to the office.
What's worse is the double-secret-probation style of PiP. The kind of email from your boss that makes you ask (sometimes actually ask, not just think), "Did I just get put on plan?" And Bossman and HR won't tell you. Those are the days where you walk into a meeting at HQ, about to head into the conference room with a customer and are dragged by HR into another room and fired because they meant to do it over the phone later that day and didn't realize you were coming in to the office.
Never been on one; although I do know a few people who have achieved the PIP goals and are still going strong on their teams. That said, teams who have lots of PIP's usually have a bad front line manager (one who should probably be on their own PIP).
PIP's can be ways for companies to manage sales people out of the business; OR can be used as coaching to genuinely salvage a good persons sales career (at that given company).
I always told myself if a PIP is in my future, then that's probably not the right company for me (for lots of reasons), and it would most likely be time to explore options.
PIP's can be ways for companies to manage sales people out of the business; OR can be used as coaching to genuinely salvage a good persons sales career (at that given company).
I always told myself if a PIP is in my future, then that's probably not the right company for me (for lots of reasons), and it would most likely be time to explore options.
It's hard to stay excited about a role while on a PiP. Exploring other options makes the most sense. That being said, I'd like to keep my job. What you said, in the beginning, gives me hope. I have this small deal that I can jam in that will buy me some more time and give me a shot of hitting my goals.
It really depends on the type of PIP that you get put on. If they put you on a two week PIP and the product has a 45 day average sales cycle, they just want you out. If the targets and timeframe make sense, then it's to light a fire under you and they still believe in giving you a chance. I've been on both sides of it early in my career.
The way to tell if you're on a secret PIP is based on the number of "Per our conversation" emails you receive from your boss that appears like it only went to you.
The way to tell if you're on a secret PIP is based on the number of "Per our conversation" emails you receive from your boss that appears like it only went to you.
Great insight thanks!
What's the over-under on the number of "Per our conversation" emails?
Well i wasn't put officially in one but I have missed my targets in two quarters and im in the same company still in a more solid position.
Did you get targets you had to hit (activity, sell something, etc..) and they had the PiP conversation with you? Or are you saying, "it's probably coming but I am going to stick it out"?
well I had that conversation actually in the 2nd company but because it was the 1st 3 months I was let go (labor laws allow for that) so they didn't invest in putting me in PiP. The 2nd time around I had targets that I had to hit (revenue to bring in) and yes I had this conversation when I missed another Q so I had it but yea the talk was useless actually.
Interesting. Thank you for that insight.
Yep. Got put on one, crushed it. Then they did it again. This time I wasn't happy. While some people are describing their company's PIP as a motivation tool to learn more, the company I worked for was just downright sadist. It got so bad one day in the lunch room, a manager startled me and I almost whacked him with my lunch. This was my cue that I was in a highly toxic environment and needed to leave. My exit story is epic. but that's another thread.
Currently on one or am about to be on one right now. I was put on an informal one originally, I hit the metrics, I had 2 solid back-to-back months, top rep for one of them, and am still getting positioned to be put on a formal PIP.
Honestly, I just find it exhausting. I'm genuinely not convinced that PIPs can be used as a motivational tool. Sure, fear inducing, but typically, reps are already at a low point when they are put on a PIP and from what I've seen usually is the kiss of death. I've seen a lot of reps put on them at this company too and most of them end up tapping out.
My situation: I was struggling to see results coming out of COVID. Also was an external hire and placed in an objectively trash territory. Did my best to push through despite the odds, had a couple okay wins, was excited for a new territory and year. 2021 got off to a slower start, but have a solid pipeline.
Even so, was starting to get a bit nervous as I noticed a shift in my manager's behaviour. I reached out asking for help stating I felt like there must be a blind spot that I can't see. The following week I'm getting metric managed to the nth degree. Little actual help came my way, just a bunch of reports confirming that I hadn't had a lot of closed revenue and a bunch of senseless activity targets that feel tone deaf.
Original targets were reasonable, even so I wavered at first as my motivation tanked, but I rallied and hit them at the end of the quarter. Had a solid month across the board. Was originally congratulated, then the following week told I still fell too short and that the metric management wasn't going anywhere.
Now they've added a bunch of other items to the laundry list, typically leveraging reports that they filter in ways that is convenient to telling the story that they want to tell.
At this point, I'm pretty sure they are just trying to exit me.
But even if they aren't, all of this has pretty much pushed me into burnout.
If anyone's got any thoughts on how to recover motivation, I am ALL EARS. Also totally open to a bunch of ppl telling me to GTFO and go make some other company rich, too...
Honestly, I just find it exhausting. I'm genuinely not convinced that PIPs can be used as a motivational tool. Sure, fear inducing, but typically, reps are already at a low point when they are put on a PIP and from what I've seen usually is the kiss of death. I've seen a lot of reps put on them at this company too and most of them end up tapping out.
My situation: I was struggling to see results coming out of COVID. Also was an external hire and placed in an objectively trash territory. Did my best to push through despite the odds, had a couple okay wins, was excited for a new territory and year. 2021 got off to a slower start, but have a solid pipeline.
Even so, was starting to get a bit nervous as I noticed a shift in my manager's behaviour. I reached out asking for help stating I felt like there must be a blind spot that I can't see. The following week I'm getting metric managed to the nth degree. Little actual help came my way, just a bunch of reports confirming that I hadn't had a lot of closed revenue and a bunch of senseless activity targets that feel tone deaf.
Original targets were reasonable, even so I wavered at first as my motivation tanked, but I rallied and hit them at the end of the quarter. Had a solid month across the board. Was originally congratulated, then the following week told I still fell too short and that the metric management wasn't going anywhere.
Now they've added a bunch of other items to the laundry list, typically leveraging reports that they filter in ways that is convenient to telling the story that they want to tell.
At this point, I'm pretty sure they are just trying to exit me.
But even if they aren't, all of this has pretty much pushed me into burnout.
If anyone's got any thoughts on how to recover motivation, I am ALL EARS. Also totally open to a bunch of ppl telling me to GTFO and go make some other company rich, too...
I so feel you on this right now
Appreciate that @Incognito - small update on this, they finally acknowledged that I wasn't going to get put on a PIP.
But tbh, the stress of the smoke and mirrors and uncertainty over those 2-3 months... I'm exhausted and struggling to do anything. May as well have pipped me...
But tbh, the stress of the smoke and mirrors and uncertainty over those 2-3 months... I'm exhausted and struggling to do anything. May as well have pipped me...
Find another job! Plenty of great companies out there with les stress
I did! Bahahaha - but after beating it all off. Stuck around long enough to hear them say you're fine, keep it up. But was interviewing actively along the way.
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