Minimum quota attainment to qualify for comp

Hey fellow sales savage,

I'm currently talking to a startup that wants me to come onboard as their CRO and essentially build out their entire sales org. The challenge I'm having is that they want to build minimum quota attainment into my plan for receiving any commission.


I think this is a terrible idea, I have something similar to where I am now and it sucks because let's face it, its enterprise SaaS and deals take time which means you will have ebbs and flows. Honestly, this is a great opportunity that includes significant co-ownership of the business, so I might accept it for myself even though I don't like it.


However, I'm more concerned that it will set precedence for the AEs and SDRs I will bring on board for the team, and I definitely don't want something like that in their plans.


Anyway, I have tried to explain to the chairman and majority owner the downside and unfairness of something like this. I have told him that there will be ups and downs and sometimes you will have somebody who won't get to the threshold one quarter even though they have been working their ass off. Perhaps they just closed a big deal last quarter at 200% of their quarterly number, but then they get to 49% the next quarter and get nothing and this will be highly demotivating to them.


On the other hand, he has said that if we don't get to our minimum threshold then we as a team are not succeeding and he wants everybody to know that and feel it. I can understand his point, and I also want everybody to understand that not making your number is not acceptable. However, I still think this is not the way to accomplish it.


I have proposed that we instead incorporate a sliding scale for commissions, so if you make 0-25% of your quota you get 25% of your normal commission percentage, if you make 25-50% you get 50%, and so on. He said he is open to discussing and also mentioned that maybe the attainment could be annual instead which I think is complicated.


He has asked me to come back with suggestions for a different model and so I turn to you guys:

  1. how would you articulate that the model of a minimum threshold for attainment is not reasonable?
  2. what other model would you suggest that still addresses his need for making it clear that we are not succeeding at 50% of our number?


I could only find one other post on this topic, so I assume this is not that common and the post also didn't go into alternative models. You know either than PAY ME ;-)


Thanks for your input!


Anywho here is that other post: https://bravado.co/war-room/posts/50-minimum-quota-to-qualify-for-commissions

Do you have a minimum threashold built into your comp plan

Attached poll
*Voting in this poll no longer yields commission.
💰 Compensation
14
SaaSam
Politicker
8
Account Executive
This guy clearly has never held a sales position. Any decent AE knows that anything less than 100% is bad so long as quota is realistic.

The sliding scale makes sense. It also makes sense to hold you as a CRO more accountable with a plan that holds you to your quota. However, no AE worth their salt will take an offer with that kind of a comp plan.
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
Thanks, I really appreciate your feedback.
Filth
Politicker
6
Live Filthy or Die Clean
Get paid for what you sell. Period.
nomdeguerre
Executive
0
Account executive
I agree with you, certainly for AEs.
jefe
Arsonist
5
🍁
I think I might have voted yes accidentally.. Sorry

Minimum is bullshit - everyone is shooting for 100%+

Sliding scale makes sense to me.
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
No problem. Appreciate the feedback.
jefe
Arsonist
6
🍁
I’ve been a rep and managed a team at an org with minimum threshold. A ton of reps didn’t hit, and it was so demotivating. As the manager I got paid on every one so would pull strings where I could to get them over but way too many people were one deal off. So brutal
nomdeguerre
Executive
2
Account executive
Just suck so much, and unlike what management thinks it doesn't motivate anyone. It just pisses them off, and the good one leaves and the grabby one stays.
jefe
Arsonist
2
🍁
100%
SaaSsy
Politicker
5
AE
First, sounds like a fun/interesting role but before accepting, make it clear that you will be making decisions for the sales org. CROs/VPs need to lead, not just be the founders’ puppet. If they aren’t willing to give that ground, move on. Then make it clear that you need great salespeople - you will not attract them with that comp plan. I like annual for enterprise SaaS and the sliding scale - are there other metrics you can tie spiffs to like license growth instead of just revenue? Also what’s the sale cycle length? That can help develop more specific incentives.
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
Thanks appreciate the input. It has been made clear that I’m in charge of my team and their plans and anything else as long as I’m within my budget. He even said that can decide what the teams plan looks like. I think it’s too early to say exactly what the sales cycle will look like, but since it’s enterprise it’s likely standard around 6-9 months. There might be other goals I can incorporate I’ll have to give that some thought. Thanks
Gasty
Notable Contributor
4
War Room Community Manager
Illogical.

Unfortunately, it's there in my company.

Worst part: Not with AE's, but with Inbound SDRs.
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
With inbound SDRs??? How does that even work? I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around that one.
Gasty
Notable Contributor
1
War Room Community Manager
If they don't get a minimum of, let's say, 60% achievement in KPIs (pipe / opps / meeting / whatever), 0 incentive.

𝐙𝐄𝐑𝐎
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
Stupid
BostonHound
Opinionated
2
Enterprise BDR
Should be illegal lol
nomdeguerre
Executive
2
Account executive
Def… should be an amendment to the constitution 😂
antiASKHOLE
Tycoon
2
Bravado's Resident Asshole
While what you are proposing makes sense, I just don't see how the retainment would be any good due to not getting paid what you are owed. I mean I wouldn't take this kind of offer.
nomdeguerre
Executive
0
Account executive
Fair point. I certainly don’t want it in the plan for my AEs.
SalesPharaoh
Big Shot
2
Senior Account Executive
Depends on your comp plan if it OTE with say 60/40 or 50/50 it makes sense but if it like % of GP then it doesn’t make sense.
nomdeguerre
Executive
0
Account executive
I might be slow but I’m not sure I follow 😟
SalesPharaoh
Big Shot
0
Senior Account Executive
So there are two ways to pay employees

1st is OTE which is on target earning
That means fixed + commission % depending on target achievement

The other is simply % ok the margin of the product you sold think like real estate brokers take a small commission on any sale they do
nomdeguerre
Executive
2
Account executive
So, you are saying in the second model, e.g. real estate brokers, there is no base salary? If that is what you mean, then I would agree it would make even less sense in the second model.

That being said, I don't think it makes sense in the first model either. In fact, and bear with me here, I don't even think quotas make sense. I know I'm crazy because that is what everyone is doing, so it must be correct, right?

Wrong, your quota, or more precisely the revenue you close is an outcome. By definition, you cannot control outcomes. You can only control your actions, what you do, or the input. If you are driving the right input into your sales process then the outcome, i.e. closed revenue, will take care of itself.

Unfortunately, everybody is so on the quota or outcome, with the constant threat over everybody's head that if you don't make the quota you are gone!

Minimum quota attainment is just making this worse - it is a super-charged version of something terrible.

Do you know what this model drives? It drives desperation, neediness, and commission breath - which is exactly what all prospects and customers hate. In other words, the model is killing what it is trying to drive, i.e. pipeline growth and revenue.

I believe the main reason for this is that the vast majority of company founders, owners, and executives have never been in sales, and have literally no clue what sales mean or how to go about building a robust sales machine. Most of them are either technical or MBA and all they know is spreadsheets and numbers, and they think that if they just figure out what the numbers should be and continue to pound those it will work - nothing could be further from the truth!

Ok, I will get off the soap box and stop rambling now, but it is something I feel very passionate about, and I intend to use it to build the right sales org.

Also, don't take my word for it. I would encourage everyone to read the late Jim Camp's books "Start with No" and "No: The only negotiation system you need for work and home". Also, "Never Split the Difference" by Chris Voss essentially says the same. Finally, "Never be Closing" by Tim Hurson is a great book too.

I realize the whole thing seems counter-intuitive and the opposite of what most people have been taught. However, I believe the only way to create truly effective sales teams is to get rid of the neediness, and that starts with not talking about the damn numbers constantly - you can't control them anyway!

Ok, I swear I'm done now ;-)
CuriousFox
WR Officer
2
🦊
No. This doesn't sound so good.
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
I don’t disagree with you.
NotCreativeEnough
Big Shot
2
Professional Day Ruiner
I clicked yes instead of no on accident...

I do not have a minimum threshold personally. I know of many companies that do that though. I would never work at one unless I had no other option. Anything that restricts my ability to earn money I'm not interested in
nomdeguerre
Executive
0
Account executive
Thanks for your feedback, I completely agree with your sentiment. I am surprised at how many actually have this in their plans though. In my little high unprofessional poll 12 (2 voted yes instead of no by accident) out of 48 have something like that in their plans, that's 25% of everyone who voted. To me that is a lot... no wonder people leave as soon as they find a better option.
SalesPharaoh
Big Shot
1
Senior Account Executive
I’m not saying it’s right but there was an organization that I was talking with wanted to recruit me and told me they don’t do quotas just salaries and your outcome will be reflected on profit share you can DM me to give you their link they are a pretty good organization
nomdeguerre
Executive
0
Account executive
Interesting, I'll DM you.

To be clear I still think you can have a commission structure, and I think that is what (almost) all salespeople want. That is the way you make a lot of money. I just think the concept of quotas is counter-productive.
TheOverTaker
Politicker
1
Senior Account Executive
attainment goals suck. if i crush a quota why does it matter how many deals it took me? company still gets paid on my hard work. so should I
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
I agree with you, but to be clear, the attainment goal suggested here is not based on the number of deals you close. It is simply based on what percentage of your quota you make, whether you do it with one deal or 100 makes no difference.

If you crush quota you will definitely be paid under this plan.
Ashing
Opinionated
1
Senior Account Executive
I'm on the sliding scale, with a massive dropoff for anything less than 71%. It keeps me motivated because I can't afford to fall off that cliff. I think that would satisfy their requirements
nomdeguerre
Executive
1
Account executive
At least it’s better. I still don’t like the idea at all. Especially for SDRs and AEs. I think they should all be paid commission on every dollar they bring in. The company is being paid the rep should get paid. Now, if you want to put accelerators in the plan, so the rep get a higher percentage on the revenue as they obtain a higher percentage of their quota that’s fine. However, I think you have to pay them something on all revenue. Anything else, really you’re just being cheap and the rep should run away. For leadership it might be a bit different, you can expect more in terms of overall quota attainment for the team.
Ashing
Opinionated
1
Senior Account Executive
Well the base salary isn't supposed to be enough to live fat on, it's enough to keep the lights on if you have a bad month. I think sales reps need to have a bit of fire under them
Kosta_Konfucius
Politicker
1
Sales Rep
I had a plan for a payroll company selling their version of smb (20-49) where we didnt get paid out 0-25%, however this is super short sales cycles. I didnt have an issue with it, but I was never at 24%. Since you are at enterprise, if you are going to do minimum, I would assume your base is higher than everyone else.
Error32
Politicker
0
ISR
I miss when people didn’t feel the need to blast intimate details about their health and personal life to thousands of strangers on the internet.
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